Fairness In Religions In School

Hi
Here is a letter I have submitted to Peter Garrett, Federal Minister for Education, and to Martin Dixon State Minister, I encourage everyone to start writing, its what Access Ministries are asking from the community and doing to undermine the the fact they have to be accountable. Politicians need to hear from real parent.
I am also writing to my school council asking that they request an explanation from access ministries and that a formal policy regarding the treatment of Opt out students is implemented.

Mr Garrett
I wish to raise my concern with funding of Access Ministries to have a near exclusive, and in Victoria compulsory, provision of Christian Religious Education.
I am a mother of 2. My son has participated in an SRI program with Access and I can personally assure you that volunteers are often inappropriate and offensive. My 5 year old became concerned we would not be together in heaven because his father and I are a registered relationship, not married. My question is why is a 5 year old even being told about marriage and the rapture (yes the good rise up and will be returned the bad will die). This is not values based.
I support the views expressed by Fairness In Religion in School http://religionsinschool.com. You will find plenty of evidence of inappropriate behavior by volunteers. You as the minster must take notice of what parents are experiencing, not just the empty promises of Access.
What we parents would like:
1. Maintain an inclusive school curriculum that does not require any student to withdraw from class on account of different religious beliefs
2. Formally cease the practice of volunteer-run special religious instruction (SRI) during school hours
3. Follow an objective, fair and balanced comparative syllabus for education about religions and beliefs
4. Treat all religious organisations who wish to use the school facilities outside of the school day with transparent and equitable policies.

Mr Garrett we need you to act, the vocal minority of Access supporters have been extracting favour and finance from the public purse and now consider themselves above scrutiny or question. They are excluded from working with children checks in Victoria but a Buddhist volunteer requires one. As an secularist I have no options – ethics is prohibited, is this Australia of the 21st century, is this an education revolution?

Hi all – as former RE teacher, I’ll add my two cents to the discussion. Here is an email I just sent to our elected government members.

I understand there is great discussion coming to the surface about religious instruction in State Schools. I’d like to share my personal experience with you.

I received training by Access Ministries at the Church Of Christ Theological Seminary (Mulgrave) and volunteered my efforts at Elwood State Primary School in 1994. During this time, I was also leading and participating in Bible & Theological Studies, Prayer Group Meetings, Youth Group Meetings and of course Church services, steeped in the Christian tradition. I can attest that during my RE year, it was not uncommon to speak to the children, at every opportunity, using all teaching aids – about the Lord Jesus and his gospel with a view to planting a seed of faith. The content of RE focused on the core Christian fundamentals and instruction of RE was about these doctrinal fundamentals. When critical questions arose, I always answered in defence of the faith and always tried to put the context back on Jesus.

Since then, I am no longer a practising Christian and am married with two boys of my own. I have searched in earnest for a good secular school but I was concerned at the blurring of church and state boundaries with the proliferation of Christian RE throughout most of these schools. There are multiple schools in Mount Waverley but there is no product differentiation when it comes to RE/RI. I was shocked to see the curriculum had not changed to reflect the multi-cultural, multi-ethnic, multi-faith, secular, rational and pluralistic demographics of Australia. There are many parents who are feeling pressured to conform and do not want their children feeling isolated or outcast. You can remove these discriminating barriers that are separating us in order to create a more equitable school environment that caters to open and critical thinking, such as a course taught by University trained personnel in comparative religion / ethics / philosophy.

With respect politically, I always find it strange how our conservative politicians favor economic privatization but don’t apply the same free-market ethos to religion?

Please make a difference, for the better.

With warm regards
George Aslanis

Our child is now in grade 5 at our local state ps (Bellaire).My husband and I were shocked-and remain so- when in prep we had to request that he NOT attend RE in a state school( I was equally shocked that it was so “creationist”) Every year we have had to go to some effort to make this request( explaining that we do not pay the RE charge etc) and there are certainly no adequate provisions made for him, and the very few others ( in some years he has been the only one),in a school that is otherwise more than adequate academically. This situation cannot continue to exist-I thought as a child my own children would live in more enlightened times! How wrong I was.

I am opposed to Religious Education in public schools but would love to see the program replaced with comparative religious studies, philosophy and ethics. Young minds love to turn over the big questions and could be taught by volunteer professors and retired teachers. Please consider how to replace the program and make it better, not just eradicating it. Teaching a religion closes the mind, teaching religion opens the mind.

Wow – this is really something
http://mike-stuchbery.com/2011/05/26/skate-your-way-to-jesus/

According to this article today:

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/access-ministries-unfairly-blamed-over-classes-bishop-20110526-1f6b8.html

the Victorian Education Department “had not received a significant number of complaints”. Perhaps we need to target the various State Education Departments as well as the MPs responsible for them?

part fo our campaign

Response received from Dee Ryall, MP – Member for Mitcham.

“Thank you for your email stating your opposition to the current policy relating to religious education in government schools.

The Government is satisfied with the existing practice, which allows parents and students to opt out of religious instruction in government schools if they do not wish to participate or if they have any issues with it. This is longstanding policy which was in place under the previous government also.

The Government has no plans to review or change the policy.

Thank you for writing to me. I appreciate having the benefit of your views on this important issue.”

Looks like the Education Department has an agenda:

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/school-claims-bullying-over-religious-education-20110618-1g95j.html

Would be interesting to see a Nelson survey to see what the community really want. (And not one that has been hacked like the one on the Age was recently)

Unfortunately, the federal minister for education, Peter Garrett, is a born-again Christian so we are most unlikely to get any support from him. He will believe that god has put him there expressly to do this great work.
More misfortune comes with the compulsory introduction of fear and sin, breaking down of parents as primary points of reference for everything in life, reduction in education about science.
Creationists do not believe in science or enquiry – the bible is the only truth to them. They refuse to allow evolution as a possibility so we have a generation of confused children to come. This is particularly sad in a country which has just produced a female Nobel Prize Winner. She should not be the last.

I have been so pleased to have come across the FIRIS website – I’m not alone!!

My son is in his Prep year at the moment and I was under the misguided assumption that he was being taught about all religions and that the class was being delivered by a qualified teacher. Silly me, I thought we lived in a secular society!

After speaking at length with his Prep teacher and the Deputy Principle I have recently informed the school in writing that he will no longer be attending the class. This decision has not been taken lightly and my husband and I have deliberated about this at length. I am very firm in my views that there is no place for Special Religious Education in our public school system, but I do not wish my son to feel left out or different. I am absolutely furious that the current system is so heavily weighted towards the interests and agenda of ACCESS Ministries, rather than in the best interests of the child. I was even more shocked when I was informed by the school that my son could not be taught anything ‘secular’ during the allocated CRE time because it would “disadvantage the other students” – but it is my son who is missing out on his education (albeit 30 mins a week) because of his non-religious beliefs!!! I never imagined that my child would be discriminated against in that way. Thankfully, my son’s Prep teacher is a very good teacher and I have come to an arrangement with her that I will send an educational activity book (literacy-based) with my son for use during the time he will not be in CRE. This will mean that she will not be in breach of Departmental regulations because the educational material is supplied by me.

Another issue I raised with the Deputy Principle was the complete absence of information for parents about what was included in the CRE curriculum and the role of ACCESS Ministries etc. I made the suggestion to the Deputy Principle that in future years, perhaps the school might like to include some balanced information to assist new parents in their decision whether to opt-out or not. I was informed that any information supplied to parents would have to come from ACCESS Ministries and the school was not allowed to say anything!!! When did ACCESS Ministries gain so much power??

Even if the regulations were changed, I was told that it would be unlikely for the school to change it’s attitude because we live in an area surrounded by a number of very large evangelical churches that donate money to the school and many of the students belong to those churches.

Is our constitutional separation of church and state a myth??

I wish that this organisation would do it’s research and expend its energy a bit more wisely. Seriously folks… Political correctness is a 20th century fad and it’s time to move on. Australia does not need or want these anti social views. Why don’t you actually do some research. You could start with our flag, It has at least four Christian crosses on it. Athieistic country (i think not)

Why are your extreme views so important that everybody else in the country has do do what you say or else?

You may find this article from yesterday’s courier mail interesting . . . .
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/holy-row-sparks-review/story-e6freoof-1226218658039

I am appalled and devastated that FIRIS considers the 4th aim to be meritorious:

4.Treat all religious organisations who wish to use the school facilities outside of the school day with transparent and equitable policies

Just when are people going to wake up to themselves and stop pandering to these religions that want access to our young children for the purposes of indoctrination of their innocent minds. Just what else do the people who voted for aim no. 4 think the religions want to do at their school premises outside of school hours? Knitting? Quilting perhaps?! They want to get access to your kids! If they can’t prosthelytize during school hours, they’ll promote some or other ‘club’, or find some other way to get your children involved and listening to their Bronze Age nonsense in a way that is pursuasive to their cause. I implore you to make a 180 degree about-face on aim 4 insisting that no religious group or person can enter the school grounds AT ANY TIME WHATSOEVER to promote or undertake any action that could be seen to be promoting any religion in any manner whatsoever.

There you have it: Transparent & Equitable!

I was just thinking..what is needed is a group that can come into schools and teach moral/ethics as well as ‘belief systems’ of the world. This is too much to expect from any religious establishment, they will always be pushing their own barrow. So what is needed is a secular organisation that can take the place of the religious. I was thinking someone needed to start such an organisation when I realised one has already been established for over 100 years…The Mechanic’s Institute. They are a secular group promoting knowlege and skills, and are already established in our communities. Could they not take the place of these bible bashers and teach the kids some real world morality? Note: I am not a member nor affiliated with the group, but thinking of joining!

I can’t quite understand why SRI/SRE as it is called in NSW isn’t abolished and GRE expanded.

My view is SRI/E presented to children is a dangerous abuse of the privileged time that should be spent on education SRI/Eis not fact or evidence based education, in fact it is like no other hour in public schooling. The education act is out of date on this important issue. Ethics and religious history of all religions is a great opportunity to help raise the next generation of Australians with less prejudice and ignorance than today, but unless change is made here, we miss a great opportunity and we leave cleaning this up to the next generation. Let’s fix this now.

Glen

Just a quick note to say congratulations on the fantastic billboard and your ongoing efforts towards the VCAT hearing.

I have been fascinated through my son’s first year of school to see the changing views of parents as they have discovered more and more that CRE is NOT a general religious overview teaching about Christmas and Easter but superhero biblical stories and prayer. One parent pulled their son out after a particularly poorly written and educationally-devoid storybook about Peter’s god-given jail bust – they actually hadn’t realised that they could make that choice until talking to us. Unfortunately most are reluctant to take the stand of actually opting out but they certainly don’t particularly like the curriculum. And many have been very disturbed by the secrecy about the curriculum and the difficulties in finding out what this class is actually all about! Unfortunately our school seems quite implicit in this. The CRE is NEVER listed on the monthly timetable, and there are two annual school church services for which your child will be taken out of the school unless you explicitly in writing state that they are not attending (and they then spend that hour doing a pointless colour in)! I have to sign a YES permission for them to do just about anything else, even when it does not involve leaving the school grounds yet, if this note got lost (not hard in a prep’s schoolbag) my child would be taken out of school and preached at without my permission or presence.

It’s worth the battle and thank you for your efforts.

Good on you young parents who care enough not to simply comply.
Make sure your children understand that you are giving them this breadth. I have a child who did not realise the value of our giving her this breadth, she sees it as not having given her a group! I tell her I have given her ‘humanism’, questioning intelligence, openness.

The billboard looks wonderful.

I just want to show my support for FIRIS. You’re doing a great job campaigning a worthy cause. If I may, I just want to add my 2 cents into the topic.

From the perspective of a CRT (relief/substitute teacher), I’ve had to sit through a few Religious Education (RE) classes myself, as I was legally obligated to look after the volunteer. I’ve been pretty upset for a while that these classes can be taught in a public school for several reasons:

* My personal opinion is that “Religious Education” should teach as the name says, religion, meaning ALL religions (Well, more than just the 3 judeo-christian religions) I think that either there should be a subject that encompasses ALL religions or get rid of RE altogether. I bet you, if there was such a subject, many parents would be up in arms at having their children exposed to other religions with differing views and gods. If parents want their children to have religious classes, they should go to a religious school.

* Students who are SUPPOSED TO BE ABSENT from these classes have nowhere/no one to look after them. I have had students that had to sit through the classes which effectively means that they’ve just undertaken the lesson with everyone else when they should’ve been absent. Great sense of responsibility of the school :-/ What confounds this problem further is that while the RE volunteers are supposed to only have 30 minutes, they tend to take longer which means that it eats into students lunchtime because they’re FORCED to be there. It’s very unfair and I have felt sorry for them. But as a CRT, you have little say in the matter and have to let things run their course.

To finish up, it’s not really to do with teaching religion in schools but I find it unfair and at odds that people cannot teach in a religious school unless you have been acredited to do so but at the same time, the people of the same background can just waltz right in and preach…I meant teach.

I hope that your campaign and foundation grows and I thankyou for your time.

Damien, please don’t make any further useless comments, particularly as none of them were valid suggestions about how this current situation could be solved!! Particularly annoying is that you can’t spell atheist properly- perhaps you need to return to school!
As a primary school student in the seventies (in Victoria)I was subjected to religious education for one week- even as a grade 2 student i realised how shambolic the so-called teaching was. Children were being bribed with chocolates and lollies to answer questions about Jesus- how on earth can this be considered ‘teaching’? I discussed this with my parents and was promptly withdrawn from classes. Whilst the rest of the class had RE I was sent to the school library. I am still astonished that this situation has not changed at all 35 years later!! I think it is plain for any objectors to the FIRIS campaign to see that the overwhelming theme is that the majority of parents, including myself, want eduction for their children about different religions and ethics, not regarding a particular religion as is the current situation. Regardless of whether or not the secular school system had christian values at inception, for some people who may not realise, this is 2012!!!!
Continuing RE in its current format is like saying that as horses and carts were good for us once, we should therefore all stop driving cars. RE in its current guise has NO ROLE to play in modern secular schools.

I support this cause.I was a CRE teacher until the end of 2010 when I resigned from Access because of unfair treatment from the paid Access staff,with no grievance procedure for me to follow.False claims were made against me ,also not addressed through any proper process and I am still waiting for justice .I could not continue to volunteer for a supposed “Christian” organization that does not practise Christian values.
Access is autonomous-it is not accountable to anyone! This is since 2006 when the board structure was changed.Before this it was CCES-Council for Christian Education in Schools and was accountable to the Victorian Council of Churches.Not many people are aware of this-particularly School Principals and supporting churches who just think Access is the same as CCES.THe curriculum has been changed and is now “fundamental” in content,with very basic cartoon-style illustrations that I believe dishonour the people and stories portrayed.CRE teacher training has been reduced to about 4 hours.There are at least three clergy who have resigned as teachers because of concerns with the content.I raised some concerns about the material given to students but was not responded to for 4 months and then the issue was not addressed.One concern was about the story of Jesus turning water into wine,presented as an example of Jesus caring for his friends-by giving them alcohol-this was for grade 1 and 2, with the teacher notes suggesting you could say if you were at a party and the wine ran out people might go home ! not a responsible message when we have such a problem with alcohol in our society.The only response from Access was that this story was used to show that Jesus is powerful.There are more examples I could give.It is quite frightening that this organization is the main provider of Special religious education in Victoria and the only accredited provider of Christian religious education with a theological position that is fundamental.So even the Christian viewpoint is biased.
I believe there should be a religious studies programme in State schools teaching about many of the world religions and taught by trained teachers as I do believe it is very important to learn about the religious beliefs and traditions in order to encourage and nurture understanding ,tolerance and delight in the diversity.All the main religions share the basic Golden Rule-do unto others what you would have them do to you or expressed as don’t do to another that which you would not like done to you.
I do believe that such a programme could be begun in Grade 1 with learning about the different festivals ,progressing to stories from sacred texts and history of the different faiths.
In the schools in which I taught children not doimg CRE were sat in another part of the room or in the computer space between classrooms.I am sorry that I didn’t think to ask could there be another way for them,though the classroom teachers were very caring of them.I am sorry that I hadn’t thought about the segrating effect of the students doing?not doing CRE-it is such an important issue.

Religious instruction is all schools in Australia should be banned completely. We are a secular society and as such should only be teaching ethics. All the isms are out. Your campaign seems aimed at allowing more religions more access to our children. If parents want to have religion taught to the children send them to a religious school. Your campaigning for the wrong answer.

Shame on Alan Jones on Sunrise this morning supporting Christian indoctrination in government schools. I have emailed Sunrise and have reminded them that we are not a Christian nation, we are a secular nation, I also sent them a link to this website and asked them to support your cause.

In school scripture lessons are the boys and girls taught that God’s word lasts forever, that his commands in the Old Testament are valid today? Isaiah 40:8 The grass withereth, the flower fadeth: but the word of our God shall stand for ever. Matthew 24:35 Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away. Are the boys and girls taught that God wants us to kill those people who worship another God? In Deuteronomy 13:6-10 God tells us to kill by stoning to death any friends or family who worship a god which is different than our own. I suppose that the boys and girls are given a sanitised version of the Bible, that they are kept in ignorance of all the God commanded rape, murder, theft and destruction. Our schools should be secular. If individuals want to indulge in religion, they should do so in their own time, and teach their children their religious doctrine outside school.

Hi, GROW UP! If you want to teach for an hour a week without pay, a class that embraces all religions then go ahead. I am sure a lot of schools would appreciate it, but these classes are taught by church volunteers. As a teacher, I am literally awe-inspired by how petty this campaign is, not everyone is christian that is true, but there are other options for students during this time.

Hi. If you want a system that works, you should look at a small school just north of Newcastle called Anna Bay Primary school. In the system they have set up, there is separate groups that the parents can nominate their children to attend. Either Christian, for those parents that want it, or a multicultural class for parents who want their children to learn diversity. Since this system was implemented, more children have been going to the non-Christian group. Why? Because the parents want them to have greater knowledge.

In saying that, Australia was founded as a Christian Nation, not a multicultural one. It is through our openness that we became multicultural. I completely agree with the teaching of multiculturalism, but by asking to take away our children’s Christian teachings, if that’s what we so choose for them to do, is taking away our choice as parents, just like this site believes your choice has been taken away.

For anyone who reads about Australia, you know it is a Christian country, predominantly, and our census supports this. The people who migrated here know this. So I support the teaching of other religions, but not by taking away a culture that has been happening in our school system since the first school was established. Diversity is fine, but we are still Australian, so please stop challenging that.

L

Additionally, this site is fast becoming a site for Christian bashing site. What you are tryin to push is more religious choice from what I can see. But instead, a lot of posts seem to be AIMED at Christianity, not religious diversity. I think this site needs to moderate more the extreme ideas some people have. We ARE a multicultural society, so get over it. There will ALWAYS be Christianity, Islam, Buddhism etc. Learn to accept it and move on. The reason this “movement” wont take any affect is if you continue to allow the extremist views AGAINST other religions to post on your site.

I love it when people have absolutely no idea of what they are talking about.
Religeous Instruction as I was taught back half a century in Queensland Schools went like this. We had a half hour period once a week, where we could go to a room and receive religeous instruction and techings as per our parents wishes, and denominations of our parents choosing. Those who’s parents decided they did not want instruction went to another room for those who did not participate. It gave kids the opportunity to learn a little about their chosen religeon. Now I still fail to see whay this needs to be in schools at all, because all of these kids should get Sunday (or another day depending on religeon) teachings at their Sunday School. Most religeons think once a week on weekends is enough, and the others have special schools for their teachings, eg Muslim, and Catholic.

So the whole argument and the neccessity for this ridiculous movement becomes redundant. Allow teachings for kids to the parents wishes as has been done for decades, and as provided by the various religeous groups, or let them stay in class and study something. How complicated is that. Or if you still find something to complain about, stop ALL religeous teaching in schools, it’s not what they are there for anyway, and let them learn at home and in Church.

I think it is really sad that you and your organisation are expending so much energy and resource trying to discredit what is essentially a positive experience for many (granted not all) kids and families throughout victorian state schools.

After reading your website it seems to me that the RIS issue is more a smoke screen for a deep seated anti creation campaign.

If you want to promulgate an anti creation theory then do so…. but don’t use the platform of kids, and primary schools to surreptitiously communicate your views. Albeit, it is a great way to get attention.

The irony here is that you are doing the very thing that you are accusing ACCESS ministries of.

Step out from behind the smoke screen and tell us what your real agenda is.

Steve

Steve, your suggestion of FIRS running an anti creation campaign is ludicrous. Surely you can’t deny the fact that atheism is a form of belief as are all the other isms. The only issue we all have is that 97% of the SRI teaching is Christianity- the campaign has nothing to do with what may or may not be true ie creationism, evolution etc . We are purely acknowledging the fact that modern day society is completely unlike the 1950s when the education department laws were enacted allowing for religious education in public schools. There is a much higher percentage of atheists and agnostics now as well as well as all of the other major religions being well represented in our multicultural society. The number of actively practicing Christians is dropping and what we are basically saying is that we would be happier for our children to be taught comparative religion not just Christianity as not all of us are Christian ie if religious education must be done within school hours. Otherwise, it should be an extracurricular activity that people can chose to attend if they wish. The fact that there is so much heated debate on this topic only illustrates how deeply personal the subject of religion is for most of us and hence why the teaching of one specific religion only should not play a role in modern government schools.

My six year old attends a school with diverse students, but CRE is promoted as the only option. She is at school to learn and make friends, not to be put behind a curtain in the corner by herself, or with a couple of other children, to read (which most preps can’t do independently). We do not want her to attend CRE, but don’t blame her for not wanting to have to stand out and take a position on a bigger issue – why is government putting small vulnerable children in this position?

I fully support everything that you are trying to achieve and appreciate the energy you have put into this. I have previously written to federal and state ministers, my school principal and the media on this, and those in positions of authority have ignored continually ignored reason and responded with rhetoric. Like most parents, we struggle to find the time and energy to keep seeking the fair go this country is famous for. We find it astounding that fairness is not what is being offered in state schools, and families have to take legal action to achieve to try to achieve this. State schools are meant to be for all children. Why can’t government listen to what families are clearly and reasonably asking for, rather than wasting money on defending an outdated and ineffective approach to teaching values?

The support of CRE, as it is currently provided, defies logic on so many levels. We live in a country that has an indigenous history and is now a multicultural community in a global world. Our census results provide clear evidence that our schools are made up of children from many beliefs and values; and that the majority are not church-going. Science has evidence to support evolution (and that the world is round!) There is evidence on child development younger children learn in a more concrete way, so we know they are impressionable when beliefs being taught as fact by untrained volunteers and an unevaluated curriculum. There are countless examples of people with religious values, even people in authority in the church, committing sins against children that defy their espoused values, and bloody wars are fought over faith, so teaching CRE offers no evidence of improving society. The resources are there to offer better alternatives, as evidenced by schools who do not inflict CRE upon families; and there are religious schools for those who choose them. Where is the evidence to say that government funding, representing our society and our children, is well spent on the current CRE program that teaches creationism as fact and effectively segregates children? If government was funding McDonalds to teach healthy eating in primary school, offered no alternative to families and spent public money defending this, the outcry would be wider but the principle is the same. A singular view is being promoted at the expense of the wider community needs.

The current opt out option does not give real evidence supporting the program; if CRE was offered like other electives, that families could choose over the rest of the curriculum, families would be more likely to walk with their feet. The recent media poll asked the wrong question to provide a meaningful gauge of the issue. Have you considered lining with AVAAZ to collect clear evidence of support for this cause?

PS I have in-laws who play the organ in church, so I am not anti-Christian. I just believe all beliefs should be respected and an over-arching value children should learn is ‘do no harm’. We teach values by what we do, not just by what we say, and by reinforcing rather than embracing difference CRE in state schools is actually doing harm.

During the past week I’ve been following media reports and FIRIS updates with great interest. The parents participating in the VCAT hearing should be commended for their commitment and courage. My children attend a state school in Melbourne’s leafy outer east… Evonne Paddison may be shocked to know there is a “small, secularist group” alive and kicking here too, even though we are not “inner-urban”. Both of my children have opted out of CRE classes run at the school. I continue to feel incredulous that children at a secular school should have to opt OUT of religious education, and hope that eventually this system will change. Our school’s provider is Access Ministries, and during the past week I have been appalled by their attempts to gain further influence in our secular school, this time via the government’s National School Chaplaincy and Student Welfare Program (NSCSWP).

On Wednesday 29th Feb, parents were invited to attend a forum at which Ainsley Carr, a representative from ACCESS Ministries, was present to answer our questions about the National School Chaplaincy and Student Welfare Program. She was, of course, also there to promote ACCESS Ministries as ‘the best man for the job’. The school Principal was also present at the forum. Myself and other parents attending were surprised to learn that the closing date for NSCSWP grant applications was Friday 2nd March at 8pm, giving our school little more than 48 hours to finalise an application and decide on an appropriate provider/recipient who could best meet the needs of our school community.

Given that ACCESS Ministries was the only provider attending the forum, some parents expressed concerns about the possibility that, were we to nominate ACCESS Ministries as the funding recipient, proselytising would occur in our school. Ms Carr assured us that would not happen, and said proselytising and evangelism are prohibited under the program guidelines. She said that while ACCESS Ministries Chaplains were drawn to chaplaincy roles because of their Christian faith and values, their intention was not to push their personal religious beliefs onto other people, but to offer a variety of support services that would improve student wellbeing and meet the diverse range of needs within the school community.

When asked about other possible providers for the role, Ms Carr informed us that all the providers on the list were Christian organisations. She finished her presentation by thanking us for asking such “wonderful questions”, stated that it was wonderful for her to have the opportunity to answer “such interesting questions” and even claimed that, in her previous experiences of liaising with other schools, she had never been presented with these sorts of questions before. One parent later commented to me that she found it hard not to vomit in response to Ms Carr’s saccharine manner and patronizing comments.

After Ms Carr had left the forum, myself and other parents approached the Principal to express our concerns at the possibility of choosing ACCESS Ministries as a provider for a wellbeing program at our secular school. Our concerns were heightened when we went home and did our own research… a quick check of the current Provider list on the DEEWR website reveals that there are at least 4 providers who are secular. But wait, there’s more… Ms Carr had handed us brochures at the start of her presentation, which we didn’t have a chance to read until we went home. The brochures read, “Victoria’s young people need to know God cares for them no matter who they are or what they have done… Young Victorians need Christian school chaplains from ACCESS Ministries. Every day of the school year, ACCESS Ministries chaplains are sharing God’s love with young Victorians.” Towards the end of the publication there is a photo of the (now infamous) Evonne Paddison, together with a list of her credentials, and a description of her demeanor – “There’s a passion for life at work here… It’s in the way she’s as comfortable lobbying for chaplaincy at Parliament as she is using ‘Jerry the Puppet’ to enthrall a tiny Prep student.” The brochure also includes ACCESS Ministries ‘vision’ for the future. It states, “Our vision is to transform a nation… it means steering ACCESS Ministries through a phase of intense growth… and ultimately it means reaching every school student in Victoria. We know just the right person for the job.”

All I can say to that is, Holy S*#%. I wish ACCESS Ministries were on trial, and I hope one day they (and Jerry the Puppet) will be barred from spreadin’ the love at state schools.

As for our particular school, fortunately, our Principal appears to be listening to our concerns and has acknowledged that further parental consultation is warranted.

Riverside Girls High School votes for a Chaplain at P&C meeting of less than 20 people. A church based provider addressed the meeting. No secular providers were there. Is this a school decision?

http://www.riversideg-h.schools.nsw.edu.au/public/website/sites/default/files/Riverside%20PandC%2029%20February%202012%20extraordinary%20meeting%20minutes%20-%20draft_0.pdf

Hi
I am working with my school to have a circular to ALL parents explaining what the SRI program is and what children who do OPT OUT will be doing during this time. before the SRI program commences in term 2. I encourage all parents approach your Principal to request this simple service to parents. I anticipate that once parents understand the facts, many more will OPT OUT.

I have found that many parents opt in because they actually think the kids are doing multi-faith studies – they have a view they have formed based on the belief that our state schools are secular. Over the past year, I have done a LOT of talking to parents at my school and I know many have opted out once they understood the reality. Information is our friend regardless of the outcome of the case tomorrow, so get onto your principal or deputy principal and ask that this information be provided to parents at your school
L

I find the logic that SRI in schools is “divisive” or causing “segregation” in the schools a bit much. Surely parents should have the right to remove their children from religious education if they want; given the current laws. So if parents didn’t have this right then the Christians would be blasted for “indoctrinating our children” … but if they can remove their children then “it’s causing segregation”.
If you’re really about ending so-called “segregation”, then I guess we better force all school children to play the same football code. If they end up playing different ones then we’ve “segregated” them. Nonsense.

Can anyone please explain the last comment to me? I must have missed something! Parents do have the right to remove their children from religious education but the argument is that we shouldn’t be forced into the making this choice in the first place. The current education department policies are antiquated compared to how society has changed over the intervening time since they were enacted and does not reflect the wishes and needs of modern day schools. By all means, either continue SRI but have it as an extracurricular subject or get rid of it entirely and replace it with a different system altogether ie ethics or comparative religious instruction would be a much better alternative.

I am quite disgusted by your huge billboards promoting non christian/no christian RE in Schools. I think what you are trying to do will cause more damage to the Australian Community and children than anything else. In case you are unaware Australia is a Free Country BECAUSE of the CHRISTIAN Religion, that promotes amongst its core values Honesty, Respect, Love, Kindness and Tolerance. If you dont share these values then quite frankly I dont consider you Australian at all. Currently Parents have a CHOICE as to sending their Children to RE or not, no one Forces the children to attend, and I find your graphics of children stigmatized because of not attending RE nothing short of RIDICULOUS. If you are that offended by it, there are plenty of Non Christian Schools you could send your children too. Stop trying to force Real Decent Australians with Decent Christian Values to withdraw from teachings of peace and love just because you have a different opinion. Take your Bigotry back to your own Countries, I am sick of it !

I’ve been following this site for a while and wish to express my admiration and full support for the members of your campaign.

You have my email address, If I can assist in any way I would be happy to.

Kathy, the FIRIS campaign relates to Christian education in NON CHRISTIAN schools!!!! Could you please get your facts straight and look at what the FIRIS campaign is actually about before you make such comments? FIRIS is NOT anti religious – just anti ONE religion only being taught in schools. With respect to honesty, respect, love, kindness and tolerance that you have mentioned- these are all good values that should be and are taught by parents NOT by religious institutions. They are values that are not exclusively the domain of religion. In fact I would be disturbed if people are solely relying on the church to teach their children morals and values!!!! Your final comment- (whatever it means)re bigotry ( and migrants????) in the last sentence is ridiculous, narrow minded and insulting!!

Kathy, if you want to understand more about how truly ignorant your comment above is, have a look at the many responses posted here:
http://religionsinschool.com/2012/03/29/we-get-ugly-rant-from-access-supporter/

If you are able to read and comprehend you will see you’ve made some big mistakes and should be posting an apology here soon.
From another dinkum Aussie supporter of freedom of religion, honesty, tolerance, and a broad secular education for all.

Well in response to Kathy’s statement may I quote Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi:

“I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.”

Maybe Kathy should be following her true follower and show love to one another rather than her nemesis whom promoted intolerance, bigotry and hatred.

As I insinuated in my previous post, it is extremely disappointing that the only supporters of religious education in its current format who post their comments on this forum are mind numbingly idiotic, clearly have no grasp of the facts whatsoever, have no sensible comments to offer – in fact are insultingly rude towards free speech, make completely ridiculous statements, usually with respect to immigration and THEIR racial intolerance, and to top it all off, certainly can’t spell to save themselves. I think their comments very transparently show how intolerant they are of their fellow human beings and quite franky, are embarrassing to read!! I cannot fathom how they can consider themselves Christians on the one hand and then proceed to write such incredibly awful untruths and propaganda!! No wonder that SRI is in the current state it is if these people are representative of the mentality of lay religious educators! SHAME ON YOU!!! I am so angry with your misrepresentation and false interpretation of such a worthy cause as FIRIS! I am usually an incredibly tolerant and fair person but I have had enough! Leave FIRIS alone and unless you have anything useful to contribute, DON’T POST YOUR CLAPTRAP ANY LONGER!!!!

@Robin

Hearing what you’re saying but freedom of speech is for ALL people even though they spout of claptrap etc. The problem with many of the xians is that talk often about freedom of speech but deny the freedom of reply. Like a typical preach from the pulpit where you the listener cannot request to question any of those details in a public forum.

What is often on our side is knowledge and intelligence. All we can do is to hit back at these “mockers” with the knowledge and intelligence where they will think twice before returning for another session.

This is our group and we allow them freedom of reply after our barrage. Please do not give them the ammunition to state that they’re being “persecuted” from withholding their freedom of speech.